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House healthcare vote today.


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Right but Obamacare doesn't limit on wealthy. Obamacare they got no help due to wealth,,new plan will be helped by age as income not considered. I dk know all the ins and outs but the whole reason new plan in place to stop things like the 400 percent premium increases since inception

 

Sorry but every single part of this post is wrong.       ACA limits the premium cost for older people.   No, the rich cannot get subsidies but they cannot charge 400% more than they do for younger people.  In the new bill they can.    And yes the new bill also does not give subsidies for anyone over 75k in income.    Your friends will be paying substantially more.

 

What 400% increases?   Mines gone up less than it did in the years before ACA and on average that's the case nationwide.

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ObamaCare jacked up rates but those rates are greatly reduced by the subsidies. The only people that get helped by ObamaCare really are the poor that get cheap insurance that is basically worthless but they do get a doctors visit. And if they have a chronic condition, they can get that covered mostly at the expense of the govt. The people that get hammered are the self-employed that make a decent amount of money. They get slaughtered.

 

Now the people that get a free ride on ObamaCare are not going to get anything. They will get a tax credit but they will not know what that is and they will not be able to afford the insurance and cover it with the tax refund they would get.

 

Rates will come down on the plans but they will not be nearly as good. You will not get a doctor visit or preventive treatment.

 

In the end, the people that can be covered cheaply will not be covered. There expenses will be absorbed by the people that pay for insurance with higher rates and everyone will eventually wind up paying more until they cry Uncle and decide to go for Medicare for All in 20 years.

I'm talking about premiums for those who do not qualify for subsidies. They are the ones getting screwed.
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I don't think you understand what I'm saying.  Revise the process.  No Oregon plans.  So South Carolina plans.  Inclusive interstate plans derived from individual insurance companies themselves.

If you have "interstate" plans, you have to have an Oregon plan and a South Carolina plan. Otherwise, there is no "interstate." The insurance companies would implement the South Carolina plan across all 50 states and it would be a shit plan.

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Sorry but every single part of this post is wrong. ACA limits the premium cost for older people. No, the rich cannot get subsidies but they cannot charge 400% more than they do for younger people. In the new bill they can. And yes the new bill also does not give subsidies for anyone over 75k in income. Your friends will be paying substantially more.

 

What 400% increases? Mines gone up less than it did in the years before ACA and on average that's the case nationwide.

I never compared rates in terms of age. I'm saying their premiums have increased 400 percent since the start of Obamacare.
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I'm talking about premiums for those who do not qualify for subsidies. They are the ones getting screwed.

Yes, they are getting screwed. But that is because the can afford to be screwed. So now they are going to get a subsidy and the poor people aren't. They are going to have their insurance rates come down initially but then all the people that have no insurance are going to drive up rates across the board and everyone will be worse off in the end.

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That's because young people and poor are not required to buy insurance and are not covered. You pay $150 for a lab to pay for all the people that do not pay.

That's one way of looking at it, another way is charging the $10 and the patient would have the ability and desire to pay...like it used to be a few decades ago.

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ObamaCare jacked up rates but those rates are greatly reduced by the subsidies. The only people that get helped by ObamaCare really are the poor that get cheap insurance that is basically worthless but they do get a doctors visit. And if they have a chronic condition, they can get that covered mostly at the expense of the govt. The people that get hammered are the self-employed that make a decent amount of money. They get slaughtered.

 

Now the people that get a free ride on ObamaCare are not going to get anything. They will get a tax credit but they will not know what that is and they will not be able to afford the insurance and cover it with the tax refund they would get.

 

Rates will come down on the plans but they will not be nearly as good. You will not get a doctor visit or preventive treatment.

 

In the end, the people that can be covered cheaply will not be covered. Their expenses will be absorbed by the people that pay for insurance with higher rates and everyone will eventually wind up paying more until they cry Uncle and decide to go for Medicare for All in 20 years.

I've heard you say this before....that the OC insurance is worthless, but they get a doctor's visit. Obviously a state by state thing, but the ACA health plans here are all the same...just a matter of how much of a subsidy you get. And there are some overly generous plans imo.
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That's irrelevant to what we're talking about. Overcharging uninsured people for services helps people survive cancer? :scratch

No, it's relevant. You and other Rs want to go back to 1955. It is not 1955 anymore. There have been medical advances. People get cancer and get treated now. People get knee replacements and other treatments that did not exist. Those all cost money. You cannot pay $10 anymore. Those days are over. You aren't going to tell people they can't have these things. They are going to tell you to F off.

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Yes, they are getting screwed. But that is because the can afford to be screwed. So now they are going to get a subsidy and the poor people aren't. They are going to have their insurance rates come down initially but then all the people that have no insurance are going to drive up rates across the board and everyone will be worse off in the end.

" They can afford to get screwed." Lol... I don't agree with that thinking at all, but I think temporarily yes it's maybe better until there can be some meeting more in the middle.

 

The new subsidies would be tied to age and not wealth. So the poor people will get the same as the wealthy, so not sure what you mean when you say poor people won't get help.

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I've heard you say this before....that the OC insurance is worthless, but they get a doctor's visit. Obviously a state by state thing, but the ACA health plans here are all the same...just a matter of how much of a subsidy you get. And there are some overly generous plans imo.

There is no such thing as an overgenerous high deductible plan. In all of these plans, you have a network or doctors. If you have one doctor out of your network involved in anything, you are F'ed.

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If you have "interstate" plans, you have to have an Oregon plan and a South Carolina plan. Otherwise, there is no "interstate." The insurance companies would implement the South Carolina plan across all 50 states and it would be a shit plan.

 

Why are you so stuck on this South Carolina plan?  What prevents an insurance company (if the process is amended) from tailoring different interstate plans to target different demographics instead of just offering a "South Carolina" plan?

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" They can afford to get screwed." Lol... I don't agree with that thinking at all, but I think temporarily yes it's maybe better until there can be some meeting more in the middle.

 

The new subsidies would be tied to age and not wealth. So the poor people will get the same as the wealthy, so not sure what you mean when you say poor people won't get help.

Because if you make 25K and you have to pay $150 per month for insurance, you probably are not going to do that. Why would you when you still have to pay $5,000 before you get any coverage. You've got to be dumber than shit to go for that. Now with Trump maybe you might get a $150 tax credit. With ObamaCare, you get that straight away. Pretty sure that is not going to happen with Trump. So you have to pay your insurance and wait for the tax credit until you pay your taxes. People are not going to be able to afford that and if they are, they are not going to understand how it works.

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No, it's relevant. You and other Rs want to go back to 1955. It is not 1955 anymore. There have been medical advances. People get cancer and get treated now. People get knee replacements and other treatments that did not exist. Those all cost money. You cannot pay $10 anymore. Those days are over. You aren't going to tell people they can't have these things. They are going to tell you to F off.

Yes you can, that's what 90% of tests cost, that's the negotiated rates the ins co's/hmo's pay. My mom before she died had tons of tests/ er visits, etc, and they were billed at obscene rates but the clinics were happy to get pennies on the dollar, because that's all medicare pays. As far as medical advances go, i've heard a lot of stuff like "well, these new machines cost  a half million or a million bucks, we have to get our money back", i bet ins co's would gladly buy the machines for the hospitals if they could and pay real prices.

 

Greed on the part of the entire medical establishment is what drives prices.

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Sorry but every single part of this post is wrong. ACA limits the premium cost for older people. No, the rich cannot get subsidies but they cannot charge 400% more than they do for younger people. In the new bill they can. And yes the new bill also does not give subsidies for anyone over 75k in income. Your friends will be paying substantially more.

 

What 400% increases? Mines gone up less than it did in the years before ACA and on average that's the case nationwide.

Sorry but every single part of this post is wrong. ACA limits the premium cost for older people. No, the rich cannot get subsidies but they cannot charge 400% more than they do for younger people. In the new bill they can. And yes the new bill also does not give subsidies for anyone over 75k in income. Your friends will be paying substantially more.

 

What 400% increases? Mines gone up less than it did in the years before ACA and on average that's the case nationwide.

In many places around the country. I think Minnesota's went up by 50-60 percent this last year.
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Why are you so stuck on this South Carolina plan?  What prevents an insurance company (if the process is amended) from tailoring different interstate plans to target different demographics instead of just offering a "South Carolina" plan?

Because they have to offer a universal plan and that plan is going to be the same across all states. They are going to need to have a plan for a certain state and then will have to offer that plan to multiple states. There will be no reason for them to do any "interstate" plans.

 

So just as with Delaware and credit card, all the insurance companies will use one of the Southern states as their model plan and that will be offered to all states. 

 

The reality is they are just going to keep offering plans on a state by state basis just as they do now. Interstates plans can't work.

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Yes you can, that's what 90% of tests cost, that's the negotiated rates the ins co's/hmo's pay. My mom before she died had tons of tests/ er visits, etc, and they were billed at obscene rates but the clinics were happy to get pennies on the dollar, because that's all medicare pays. As far as medical advances go, i've heard a lot of stuff like "well, these new machines cost  a half million or a million bucks, we have to get our money back", i bet ins co's would gladly buy the machines for the hospitals if they could and pay real prices.

 

Greed on the part of the entire medical establishment is what drives prices.

 

The biggest rising expense is prescription drugs.  But greed is good I thought.

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Yes you can, that's what 90% of tests cost, that's the negotiated rates the ins co's/hmo's pay. My mom before she died had tons of tests/ er visits, etc, and they were billed at obscene rates but the clinics were happy to get pennies on the dollar, because that's all medicare pays. As far as medical advances go, i've heard a lot of stuff like "well, these new machines cost  a half million or a million bucks, we have to get our money back", i bet ins co's would gladly buy the machines for the hospitals if they could and pay real prices.

 

Greed on the part of the entire medical establishment is what drives prices.

Yes. You are not much of a Republican. Haven't you ever heard of the free market?

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